Why some over others when it comes to UFO Experiences?

Hybrid Number of posts : 616 Registration date : 2009-06-10

So why do you think some people are picked over others as far as Abduction or Contactee experiences when it comes to UFO experiences? What meets the criteria? Why one person over another? Someone once told me that soon it will be a world of Contactees and Non-Contactees? But really why do you think some have these experiences and others do not? Soul Evolution? Sign up for it before you incarnated into this realm? Alien family relations? Milabs government agencies? All of above and then some probably! I would love to hear you're perspectives on this..

Guest

I do not think people have a choice in the abductions that happen to them. It is more random like a biologist setting out to trap an animal to retrieve data from. Some people may be unlucky enough to have a tracking device put in them and be abducted multiple times, just like a poor mountain lion.

As for contactees, it could be like a shaman who has the ability to go into a trance. Some people might be born with the ability to contact an extraterrestrial or other entity.

We don't even know how many abduction stories and alleged contactee events are true, let alone any data involved. It is entirely possible WE are creating the mystery involved here, or at least amplifying it. In my entire 55 years of whatever has been going on, I have had only one experience back in the 60s that resembles being "on a table and worked on." And that experience was a visual black out (couldn't see ANYTHING), with a hand running over my teenage head with feeling of: "It's OK, don't worry - you are safe" going through my mind. Someone was working on my left leg, but I have NO clue what was going on. It would be about 30 or so years before I ever read about "aliens" and this kind of picture.

I've said this before, I have never once been mistreated or frightened to a panic level. I don't understand why others have the events they have - unless, they aren't seeing it and it's day residue based on everything they see on TV, hear from people, and read in books.

onlychild wrote:: We don't even know how many abduction stories and alleged contactee events are true, let alone any data involved. It is entirely possible WE are creating the mystery involved here, or at least amplifying it. In my entire 55 years of whatever has been going on, I have had only one experience back in the 60s that resembles being "on a table and worked on." And that experience was a visual black out (couldn't see ANYTHING), with a hand running over my teenage head with feeling of: "It's OK, don't worry - you are safe" going through my mind. Someone was working on my left leg, but I have NO clue what was going on. It would be about 30 or so years before I ever read about "aliens" and this kind of picture.

I've said this before, I have never once been mistreated or frightened to a panic level. I don't understand why others have the events they have - unless, they aren't seeing it and it's day residue based on everything they see on TV, hear from people, and read in books.

Interesting my experiences have been similar with a visual black out.
Well the reasons could be mixed. Some subjects are random subjects like in the mountain lion example. Some may have interesting genetic traits.

Some abductions are conducted by caring or some what ethical groups of EBE's like in Onlychilds case and through my experience. Where in others are not so pleasant and the creatures or groups conducting the experiments skip steps because they don't care and in some extreme cases we never hear about them because they are either killed or kept or are going to be returned in the distant future or are returned to the middle of the wilderness or just dropped off in the ocean and die from exposure. Truely horrifying.

Honestly your guess is as good as mines but they can't experiment on everybody. My experience has been to simply trust whats going on and not resist (as if I could) just relax and rest because you will be returned.

Seeker Number of posts : 35 Registration date : 2010-04-29

Ufofiend wrote:: So why do you think some people are picked over others as far as Abduction or Contactee experiences when it comes to UFO experiences? What meets the criteria? Why one person over another? Someone once told me that soon it will be a world of Contactees and Non-Contactees? But really why do you think some have these experiences and others do not? Soul Evolution? Sign up for it before you incarnated into this realm? Alien family relations? Milabs government agencies? All of above and then some probably! I would love to hear you're perspectives on this..

With all due respect - you're looking at it backwards.

We Contactees aren't pick - we have had prior relationships with those who contact' us in this life. You can't look at these phenomena in such narrow terms, as this life alone.

We (those of us known as Contactees) have had a prior history with many within our clan, some of whom exist as our 'Contactors'

Some Contactees are consciously aware of this - many are not.

Nevertheless, that's the case.

Cheers
John Hughes

...

John Hughes wrote:: With all due respect - you're looking at it backwards.

We Contactees aren't pick - we have had prior relationships with those who contact' us in this life. You can't look at these phenomena in such narrow terms, as this life alone.

We (those of us known as Contactees) have had a prior history with many within our clan, some of whom exist as our 'Contactors'

Some Contactees are consciously aware of this - many are not.

Nevertheless, that's the case.

Cheers
John Hughes
...

Everything that is can be explained with words if the data exists. How would you prove your statements? This is how this subject has become the mess it is today because people just say things and can't back them up with data, in fact it has gone as far as "we don't need proof."
No data - no truth. It isn't that I don't WANT to believe you (or anyone else for that matter when this pops up), I just can't. Pictures like this collide with what I call the Distance Factor, which is a total lack of understanding of WHY things are going on. My experiences run 55+ years, and your picture makes no sense to me. Why do you think that is?

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

John Hughes wrote:: With all due respect - you're looking at it backwards.

We Contactees aren't pick - we have had prior relationships with those who contact' us in this life. You can't look at these phenomena in such narrow terms, as this life alone.

We (those of us known as Contactees) have had a prior history with many within our clan, some of whom exist as our 'Contactors'

Some Contactees are consciously aware of this - many are not.

Nevertheless, that's the case.

Cheers
John Hughes
...

Everything that is can be explained with words if the data exists. How would you prove your statements? This is how this subject has become the mess it is today because people just say things and can't back them up with data, in fact it has gone as far as "we don't need proof."
No data - no truth. It isn't that I don't WANT to believe you (or anyone else for that matter when this pops up), I just can't. Pictures like this collide with what I call the Distance Factor, which is a total lack of understanding of WHY things are going on. My experiences run 55+ years, and your picture makes no sense to me. Why do you think that is?

What is proof? Factual evidence is of the past and habitual. It is something that leaves physical presence. Then we have the mind. This is opinion (good/ bad) about these events or memories, which materialists won't accept as proof because it is between the ears of the individual concerned and 'could' be a lie (Google: topografia cerebral de pessoas abduzidas, for way to check if someone is a genuine contactee or a fantasist - brain wave research). Then you have interpretation of the physical evidence and this again is between the ears stuff and opinion of its significance. Some people are treated as animals to be experimented on (abductees) and others nurtured for a more different role (contactees). The latter group are schooled and the former group are herded in ignorance. It is purpose and worth that are in question here. It isn't 'either or' but this and that, together. Aliens are no different to humans. We abuse animals and other humans, so let's not take the moral high ground over this. Likewise we can ourselves nurture and fight for better conditions for other human beings and our livestock (Temple Grandin and the handling of animals in slaughter houses and stockyards). Once you see it as flows of energy in opposing directions,the whole thing becomes clearer - dispassionately so (I will post more on this at a later date).

paigetheoracle wrote:: What is proof? Factual evidence is of the past and habitual. It is something that leaves physical presence. Then we have the mind. This is opinion (good/ bad) about these events or memories, which materialists won't accept as proof because it is between the ears of the individual concerned and 'could' be a lie (Google: topografia cerebral de pessoas abduzidas, for way to check if someone is a genuine contactee or a fantasist - brain wave research). Then you have interpretation of the physical evidence and this again is between the ears stuff and opinion of its significance. Some people are treated as animals to be experimented on (abductees) and others nurtured for a more different role (contactees). The latter group are schooled and the former group are herded in ignorance. It is purpose and worth that are in question here. It isn't 'either or' but this and that, together. Aliens are no different to humans. We abuse animals and other humans, so let's not take the moral high ground over this. Likewise we can ourselves nurture and fight for better conditions for other human beings and our livestock (Temple Grandin and the handling of animals in slaughter houses and stockyards). Once you see it as flows of energy in opposing directions,the whole thing becomes clearer - dispassionately so (I will post more on this at a later date).

I give up - it's hopeless. Retirement here I come.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: What is proof? Factual evidence is of the past and habitual. It is something that leaves physical presence. Then we have the mind. This is opinion (good/ bad) about these events or memories, which materialists won't accept as proof because it is between the ears of the individual concerned and 'could' be a lie (Google: topografia cerebral de pessoas abduzidas, for way to check if someone is a genuine contactee or a fantasist - brain wave research). Then you have interpretation of the physical evidence and this again is between the ears stuff and opinion of its significance. Some people are treated as animals to be experimented on (abductees) and others nurtured for a more different role (contactees). The latter group are schooled and the former group are herded in ignorance. It is purpose and worth that are in question here. It isn't 'either or' but this and that, together. Aliens are no different to humans. We abuse animals and other humans, so let's not take the moral high ground over this. Likewise we can ourselves nurture and fight for better conditions for other human beings and our livestock (Temple Grandin and the handling of animals in slaughter houses and stockyards). Once you see it as flows of energy in opposing directions,the whole thing becomes clearer - dispassionately so (I will post more on this at a later date).

I give up - it's hopeless. Retirement here I come.

Good!

paigetheoracle wrote:

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: What is proof? Factual evidence is of the past and habitual. It is something that leaves physical presence. Then we have the mind. This is opinion (good/ bad) about these events or memories, which materialists won't accept as proof because it is between the ears of the individual concerned and 'could' be a lie (Google: topografia cerebral de pessoas abduzidas, for way to check if someone is a genuine contactee or a fantasist - brain wave research). Then you have interpretation of the physical evidence and this again is between the ears stuff and opinion of its significance. Some people are treated as animals to be experimented on (abductees) and others nurtured for a more different role (contactees). The latter group are schooled and the former group are herded in ignorance. It is purpose and worth that are in question here. It isn't 'either or' but this and that, together. Aliens are no different to humans. We abuse animals and other humans, so let's not take the moral high ground over this. Likewise we can ourselves nurture and fight for better conditions for other human beings and our livestock (Temple Grandin and the handling of animals in slaughter houses and stockyards). Once you see it as flows of energy in opposing directions,the whole thing becomes clearer - dispassionately so (I will post more on this at a later date).

I give up - it's hopeless. Retirement here I come.

Good!

Look, everything in this picture concerns the brain, how it works, and the epic failure regarding cognition. The absence of what can be called meta-cognition, which is basically thinking about thinking, is also absent from this picture. There is literally no structure, no formal approach to anything in this subject - it is STILL "this is what I believe" and it doesn't go any further than that.

The ancients failed epically for ONE SIMPLE REASON - there was NO data regarding HOW life worked or how the cosmos worked. Instead of looking for a cause, they looked for a personality, a WHO rather than HOW. The bottom line here simply regards a lack of data, and people today are doing the exact same thing. Rather than say "I had a dream", they believe that dream was real. This is day residue thinking, and it doesn't go any further than that - unless there is hard evidence.

Until people stop making a mountain out of a molehill with this subject, they will never see what is going on.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: What is proof? Factual evidence is of the past and habitual. It is something that leaves physical presence. Then we have the mind. This is opinion (good/ bad) about these events or memories, which materialists won't accept as proof because it is between the ears of the individual concerned and 'could' be a lie (Google: topografia cerebral de pessoas abduzidas, for way to check if someone is a genuine contactee or a fantasist - brain wave research). Then you have interpretation of the physical evidence and this again is between the ears stuff and opinion of its significance. Some people are treated as animals to be experimented on (abductees) and others nurtured for a more different role (contactees). The latter group are schooled and the former group are herded in ignorance. It is purpose and worth that are in question here. It isn't 'either or' but this and that, together. Aliens are no different to humans. We abuse animals and other humans, so let's not take the moral high ground over this. Likewise we can ourselves nurture and fight for better conditions for other human beings and our livestock (Temple Grandin and the handling of animals in slaughter houses and stockyards). Once you see it as flows of energy in opposing directions,the whole thing becomes clearer - dispassionately so (I will post more on this at a later date).

I give up - it's hopeless. Retirement here I come.

Good!

Look, everything in this picture concerns the brain, how it works, and the epic failure regarding cognition. The absence of what can be called meta-cognition, which is basically thinking about thinking, is also absent from this picture. There is literally no structure, no formal approach to anything in this subject - it is STILL "this is what I believe" and it doesn't go any further than that.

The ancients failed epically for ONE SIMPLE REASON - there was NO data regarding HOW life worked or how the cosmos worked. Instead of looking for a cause, they looked for a personality, a WHO rather than HOW. The bottom line here simply regards a lack of data, and people today are doing the exact same thing. Rather than say "I had a dream", they believe that dream was real. This is day residue thinking, and it doesn't go any further than that - unless there is hard evidence.

Until people stop making a mountain out of a molehill with this subject, they will never see what is going on.

At last you've made a stand and said something I can respond to. Can I say that anything I've witnessed has solid, physical existence? No. I totally agree with what you are saying about Who versus How - it is worship of the phenomena as opposed to scientific exploration of it. As for it being just blind faith - this is also true to a degree but look at scientific theories about how the universe works, that is belief too. Not all my experiences happened in the bedroom, while I was asleep or in the state of waking up (Giving it a name like hypnopompic or hypnogogic imagery isn't proof of what it is but a theory too, used to dismiss the phenomena in too many cases rather than investigate and correlate this belief with evidence: In other words lazy attempts to block out what is going on, rather than study it psychologically). I saw my first UFO while fully awake, walking home from school with some friends (The same UFO was described and pictured in a book, stating it had been seen worldwide - John Keel, UFOs: Operation Trojan Horse). The strange thing was that none of my friends saw it, despite it being slowly drifting between clouds, several hundred feet long and visible for ten minutes. I wrote to Fortean Times letters page about this, after seeing a TV program, where another person witnessed the same thing in perfect daylight conditions but the other occupants of the car claimed to see nothing but panicked and drove madly out of the area when their son tried to reach for a camera to take a picture of it. Somebody replied to the FT letter, claiming yet again that the same thing had happened to them.

You say it is unimportant and subjective. I'd say that it isn't necessarily scientifically important but that it is psychologically important. I personally think it relates to mental health conditions but not in the way you think, presumably. Schizophrenics and others report hearing voices and a Dutch therapist has found that the way to overcome this is to integrate these voices into a single personality (Look up Multiple Personality Disorder, which nowadays has a new name). Of course it doesn't relate directly to UFO/ alien contactees because this is a mostly visual phenomena. I believe the paranormal is mostly about energy manipulation and I admired the work of Professor Persinger of Laurentian University, Canada and Jenny Randles, the UFO researcher because both have proposed something going on like EM energy.

That will do as it is enough for you to chew over (Love me or hate me I won't make a meal of it - talking of which did you see The Charlie Sheen Roast on Comedy Central? Life isn't all science - there is entertainment too and maybe that is the value of this phenomena)

[quote="paigetheoracle"]
At last you've made a stand and said something I can respond to. Can I say that anything I've witnessed has solid, physical existence? No. I totally agree with what you are saying about Who versus How - it is worship of the phenomena as opposed to scientific exploration of it. As for it being just blind faith - this is also true to a degree but look at scientific theories about how the universe works, that is belief too.

In my approach this is OK, as long as one separates the hard data from the soft; objective vs subjective, and calls a theory a theory. As close as I can get to what is going on between us and ET, is a subject called constructivist teaching and learning. We are being forced to THINK - and beyond this, metacognition, which is thinking about HOW we are thinking.

Not all my experiences happened in the bedroom, while I was asleep or in the state of waking up (Giving it a name like hypnopompic or hypnogogic imagery isn't proof of what it is but a theory too, used to dismiss the phenomena in too many cases rather than investigate and correlate this belief with evidence: In other words lazy attempts to block out what is going on, rather than study it psychologically). I saw my first UFO while fully awake, walking home from school with some friends (The same UFO was described and pictured in a book, stating it had been seen worldwide - John Keel, UFOs: Operation Trojan Horse). The strange thing was that none of my friends saw it, despite it being slowly drifting between clouds, several hundred feet long and visible for ten minutes. I wrote to Fortean Times letters page about this, after seeing a TV program, where another person witnessed the same thing in perfect daylight conditions but the other occupants of the car claimed to see nothing but panicked and drove madly out of the area when their son tried to reach for a camera to take a picture of it. Somebody replied to the FT letter, claiming yet again that the same thing had happened to them.

This is what Piaget calls schema, and essentially this would be the building blocks of learning we can fall back on. Like my first experiences back in '55, nothing happened beyond what I saw, and it is nothing more than something to ponder - it is not "the all encompassing picture" by itself, it's just a piece to ponder in the context of a full picture that developed over time. People tend to use schmata as a final picture, and get nowhere because of it.

You say it is unimportant and subjective. I'd say that it isn't necessarily scientifically important but that it is psychologically important. I personally think it relates to mental health conditions but not in the way you think, presumably. Schizophrenics and others report hearing voices and a Dutch therapist has found that the way to overcome this is to integrate these voices into a single personality (Look up Multiple Personality Disorder, which nowadays has a new name). Of course it doesn't relate directly to UFO/ alien contactees because this is a mostly visual phenomena. I believe the paranormal is mostly about energy manipulation and I admired the work of Professor Persinger of Laurentian University, Canada and Jenny Randles, the UFO researcher because both have proposed something going on like EM energy.

Everything (for me) is defined by the overall picture. I have had WEIRD events, that if taken as a single experience, could be defined differently. However, in the overall context they fit as a single piece of an evolving idea. It didn't come from me - as I knew NOTHING of the topics involved. So, the picture supports itself and final conclusions stand as a given picture with an attached explanation.

That will do as it is enough for you to chew over (Love me or hate me I won't make a meal of it - talking of which did you see The Charlie Sheen Roast on Comedy Central? Life isn't all science - there is entertainment too and maybe that is the value of this phenomena)

LOL ... understand that I can be the biggest pain in the ass that ever walked in two shoes. My approach is simply collecting data, and enlarging the final picture if possible. In my approach there were people who should have been here today to handle this topic, but they disappeared by the 1800s - absorbed it seems into the expanding esoteric movement back then. We are on our own - and so far, the picture isn't looking good.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

[quote="onlychild"]

paigetheoracle wrote:: At last you've made a stand and said something I can respond to. Can I say that anything I've witnessed has solid, physical existence? No. I totally agree with what you are saying about Who versus How - it is worship of the phenomena as opposed to scientific exploration of it. As for it being just blind faith - this is also true to a degree but look at scientific theories about how the universe works, that is belief too.

In my approach this is OK, as long as one separates the hard data from the soft; objective vs subjective, and calls a theory a theory. As close as I can get to what is going on between us and ET, is a subject called constructivist teaching and learning. We are being forced to THINK - and beyond this, metacognition, which is thinking about HOW we are thinking.

Not all my experiences happened in the bedroom, while I was asleep or in the state of waking up (Giving it a name like hypnopompic or hypnogogic imagery isn't proof of what it is but a theory too, used to dismiss the phenomena in too many cases rather than investigate and correlate this belief with evidence: In other words lazy attempts to block out what is going on, rather than study it psychologically). I saw my first UFO while fully awake, walking home from school with some friends (The same UFO was described and pictured in a book, stating it had been seen worldwide - John Keel, UFOs: Operation Trojan Horse). The strange thing was that none of my friends saw it, despite it being slowly drifting between clouds, several hundred feet long and visible for ten minutes. I wrote to Fortean Times letters page about this, after seeing a TV program, where another person witnessed the same thing in perfect daylight conditions but the other occupants of the car claimed to see nothing but panicked and drove madly out of the area when their son tried to reach for a camera to take a picture of it. Somebody replied to the FT letter, claiming yet again that the same thing had happened to them.

This is what Piaget calls schema, and essentially this would be the building blocks of learning we can fall back on. Like my first experiences back in '55, nothing happened beyond what I saw, and it is nothing more than something to ponder - it is not "the all encompassing picture" by itself, it's just a piece to ponder in the context of a full picture that developed over time. People tend to use schmata as a final picture, and get nowhere because of it.

You say it is unimportant and subjective. I'd say that it isn't necessarily scientifically important but that it is psychologically important. I personally think it relates to mental health conditions but not in the way you think, presumably. Schizophrenics and others report hearing voices and a Dutch therapist has found that the way to overcome this is to integrate these voices into a single personality (Look up Multiple Personality Disorder, which nowadays has a new name). Of course it doesn't relate directly to UFO/ alien contactees because this is a mostly visual phenomena. I believe the paranormal is mostly about energy manipulation and I admired the work of Professor Persinger of Laurentian University, Canada and Jenny Randles, the UFO researcher because both have proposed something going on like EM energy.

Everything (for me) is defined by the overall picture. I have had WEIRD events, that if taken as a single experience, could be defined differently. However, in the overall context they fit as a single piece of an evolving idea. It didn't come from me - as I knew NOTHING of the topics involved. So, the picture supports itself and final conclusions stand as a given picture with an attached explanation.

That will do as it is enough for you to chew over (Love me or hate me I won't make a meal of it - talking of which did you see The Charlie Sheen Roast on Comedy Central? Life isn't all science - there is entertainment too and maybe that is the value of this phenomena)

LOL ... understand that I can be the biggest pain in the ass that ever walked in two shoes. My approach is simply collecting data, and enlarging the final picture if possible. In my approach there were people who should have been here today to handle this topic, but they disappeared by the 1800s - absorbed it seems into the expanding esoteric movement back then. We are on our own - and so far, the picture isn't looking good.

I collect data too. It seems that I've been working downwards from the bigger picture to specifics and yes, like you, I seem to have ended up topics that I didn't understand and normally wouldn't have any interest in. On top of that I seem to have been guided into some situations which left me screaming at their madness, mostly four relationships that had psychic events surrounding them (in three of the cases anyway).

Who are the esoteric movement people you mention? American? European? Worldwide?

Again I agree about the fact that they are forcing us to think (grow up/ stand on our own two feet).

paigetheoracle wrote:: I collect data too. It seems that I've been working downwards from the bigger picture to specifics and yes, like you, I seem to have ended up topics that I didn't understand and normally wouldn't have any interest in. On top of that I seem to have been guided into some situations which left me screaming at their madness, mostly four relationships that had psychic events surrounding them (in three of the cases anyway).

Who are the esoteric movement people you mention? American? European? Worldwide?

This was the Masonic expansion movement that started a few centuries back. It's the only thing I can see that explains the disappearance of the people I believe were always there.

Again I agree about the fact that they are forcing us to think (grow up/ stand on our own two feet).

There are many who will not make it.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: I collect data too. It seems that I've been working downwards from the bigger picture to specifics and yes, like you, I seem to have ended up topics that I didn't understand and normally wouldn't have any interest in. On top of that I seem to have been guided into some situations which left me screaming at their madness, mostly four relationships that had psychic events surrounding them (in three of the cases anyway).

Who are the esoteric movement people you mention? American? European? Worldwide?

This was the Masonic expansion movement that started a few centuries back. It's the only thing I can see that explains the disappearance of the people I believe were always there.

Again I agree about the fact that they are forcing us to think (grow up/ stand on our own two feet).

There are many who will not make it.

Ah, the Masons!

No,sadly many won't make it because they don't want to try. Easier to turn their back on the truth and not be responsible for it and their own existence.

The link to Norman Don's work is relevant to what is going on as last night I thought 'So contactees can automatically get into a beta wave trance state, so what?' This morning I had my answer - only 2.5 per cent of light is visible to us. To see them, we may need to reach a part not normally visible to most humans and requires us to be in this state. Think of tuning into TV or radio stations. They are there but we have no connection with them until we tune into them. My first UFO was completely invisible to those around me and I've learned since then that this is not unusual (TV interview mentioning similar case and reply to letter I wrote to magazine).

By the way science doesn't talk about matter except as affected by energy (waves) - life as a process of energy moving through matter.

paigetheoracle wrote:: No,sadly many won't make it because they don't want to try. Easier to turn their back on the truth and not be responsible for it and their own existence.

Well, me thinks if we stopped over-thinking this subject and just stuck to the base facts, we could make it. After everything I had gone through, the picture boils down to STOP THINKING. We have no data beyond the simple picture that SOMETHING is coming and they are here - for some reason. We are all over the board with unverified explanations, and it's no wonder that people turn away from this subject. We simply have a tendency to overdue it.

I think one of best subjects to picture this is the history of the Jewish messiah. It began as a simple picture, and over time morphed into something completely different. Then Paul pops up, and there are no original manuscripts available to compare what we DO have to a line of truth. Then (as if we need more) Catholicism takes everything to a completely new level. On top of all this, the denominational splits that have appeared over time create an even bigger mess. This is how we do things.

The ancients had their view of life, and this subject was just a part of it. We are going through what we are going through today because we lost that tiny piece of information. All we need to do is shut up, stop making a mountain out of a mole hill, and focus on a simple picture. Where in history do we find a problem with ET? Outside of modern personal interpretations (like Sitchin) who was proven wrong by a scholar in the field, there is no picture of problems with ET. So what are we afraid of? Personal interpretations of "things that go bump in the night"?

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: No,sadly many won't make it because they don't want to try. Easier to turn their back on the truth and not be responsible for it and their own existence.

Well, me thinks if we stopped over-thinking this subject and just stuck to the base facts, we could make it. After everything I had gone through, the picture boils down to STOP THINKING. We have no data beyond the simple picture that SOMETHING is coming and they are here - for some reason. We are all over the board with unverified explanations, and it's no wonder that people turn away from this subject. We simply have a tendency to overdue it.

I think one of best subjects to picture this is the history of the Jewish messiah. It began as a simple picture, and over time morphed into something completely different. Then Paul pops up, and there are no original manuscripts available to compare what we DO have to a line of truth. Then (as if we need more) Catholicism takes everything to a completely new level. On top of all this, the denominational splits that have appeared over time create an even bigger mess. This is how we do things.

The ancients had their view of life, and this subject was just a part of it. We are going through what we are going through today because we lost that tiny piece of information. All we need to do is shut up, stop making a mountain out of a mole hill, and focus on a simple picture. Where in history do we find a problem with ET? Outside of modern personal interpretations (like Sitchin) who was proven wrong by a scholar in the field, there is no picture of problems with ET. So what are we afraid of? Personal interpretations of "things that go bump in the night"?

The unintelligent complicate things to 'appear' intelligent - the truly intelligent simplify things to 'be' intelligent. This is why things are overdone - division and derision or the simple truth. This is what Zen is about - getting us to see how we avoid dealing with issues by complicating them ('It's too difficult to resolve'), instead of simplifying them and acting automatically. Everything starts off simple and grows more complicated over time (evolution).'Words, words, words' as Shakespeare put it. Open your eyes, shut your mouth and ignore the verbal shenanigans aimed at distracting you from the truth (the lies and distractions of magicians, aimed at misdirecting your attention, while they carry out their tricks).

It's a market place and those shouting the loudest and lying the most (see what Hitler had to say on this), get the most attention but lose it in the end when people get bored or go cold turkey (Yes it's addictive).

Talking of personal interpretation, I don't believe a lot of conspiracy theories flying round. A lot of it is just speculation based on the belief in deliberate action instead of human stupidity (Pearl Harbour/ Twin Towers). Things happen through laziness and cowardice and I don't mean that in an emotional leverage sense, aimed at trying to provoke people into action but in the sense of not doing/ avoiding).

Talking of evidence, when we were on holiday recently, we were told that sheep had gotten into the grounds of the house (fact) because the postman had left the gate open. I left one of the dogs in the garden and it got out (fact),which led me to conclude that it had jumped over the fence (theory). My wife caught the dog in the neighbours field, the following day (fact) and I checked out the fence near the garage end, where she ran loose. There I found sheep had been pushing under it (bulge in the middle, covered with wool). I mended the fence and the following day we found the perplexed dog, puzzled as to why it wasn't out in the field again, proving that only physical exploration and experience discloses the truth of the matter: The slow man stops and examines - the fast man rushes by, seeing nothing (loses vision in a blur of motion/ emotion). In Scientology they talked of the reactive mind and the analytical mind or doers and thinkers. We need both in society (manual workers versus office workers, sportsmen versus intellectuals etc). When I was on The Hypography Science Forums site, they said consistently in the comments that my posts/ threads were highly logical and thoroughly worked out.

By the way what did you mean about people disappearing, when the Masons came into existence? (ordinary people/ prominent members of society/ others?).

paigetheoracle wrote:: The unintelligent complicate things to 'appear' intelligent - the truly intelligent simplify things to 'be' intelligent. This is why things are overdone - division and derision or the simple truth.

While intelligent / unintelligent is in the picture, our main problem is that we were never taught in school how the brain works - and that single idea is the real root of all of ALL our problems in this subject. The ancients weren't stupid, they were undereducated in some areas, like life and the cosmos. Their left hemisphere wasn't dead - it was useless for the simple reason - they had NO information to work with.

We are only now slowly coming out of this, and the education process should include this subject beginning at least in Jr High. People today still insist on personifying aspects of life (mythopoeic thinking), and seeing things where "things" do not exist (pareidolia). I'll give you an example of the latter that I found regarding the 'head' area of the Orion nebula. I found this picture while cruising pictures of m42-M43 / the Orion Nebula awhile back. If you look at this, there seems to be a "grey" head emerging from a more "human" head. Is this what is really there? Or is this just a coincidence created by expanding gases? Maybe it's - ET art work LOL ... or a created CG picture.

I split both figures away from each other, mirrored each half and folded it over to create a complete "face" for both halves. Is this real? Is the nebula sending us a message? Or is it just a created picture based on what we think we see?

By the way what did you mean about people disappearing, when the Masons came into existence? (ordinary people/ prominent members of society/ others?).

The premise is based on logic and human nature. 5000+ years ago fear created a scenario that changed thinking in one area of the globe, Egypt and Sumer. Since human nature doesn't change, I would say there had to be people who disagreed with any changes to doctrine, and they packed their bags and left the area. Over time they would have been living in plain sight with the rest of the population, and no one would have known they were there.

Glimpses of the idea would pop up here and there in religious texts, but the first major move to activate the main belief itself became the religion we know as Christianity. All the component parts are there, it's just a different cast of characters. Biblical scholars have shown that "Paul" expected the "end" in his lifetime - but it never happened. The texts were altered by unknown writers in specific places to cover the error and make it look like it would come - later. We have been waiting 2000 years, a ton of guesstimates over that time have surfaced, and all have been wrong.

Earlier in the game I thought "the people who knew" just disbanded after that, but things popped up that said no, they were still there. The last person who seemed to have run into them was Nostradamus, seemingly after he dropped out of the picture for 6 years. There are a very small handful of quatrains that show he knew about our fallen history, as well as when it happened - and THAT is impossible.

If these people had been living their lives in secret, when the Masonic movement began to expand it would almost seem like they belonged together - so ... they joined up?

I say this because of at least two works that popped up: one was 'Fulcanelli's' addition to 'his' 1926 book in 1957. The main idea expressed is fear - 'something bad is coming' and it is going to be catastrophic. The second was published ten years later, called the Red Serpent document. This document is an esoteric quest in the context of destruction, to find the key - the feminine character involved in this - and he found it. From here we can add the Georgia Guidestones, as well as all of the crap that has gone on at least since 911. They know. They also know that we are supposed to know - and we don't - and in true sociopathic form ... they don't care.

Seeing as I can trace a small picture that seems to end in 1885, and pops up today in a quest for an answer to the same base question, what else can I think? "The people who knew" should have surfaced by now, and haven't. What we DO have are the WRONG people waving the material in front of our faces - and not telling us anything.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: The unintelligent complicate things to 'appear' intelligent - the truly intelligent simplify things to 'be' intelligent. This is why things are overdone - division and derision or the simple truth.

While intelligent / unintelligent is in the picture, our main problem is that we were never taught in school how the brain works - and that single idea is the real root of all of ALL our problems in this subject. The ancients weren't stupid, they were undereducated in some areas, like life and the cosmos. Their left hemisphere wasn't dead - it was useless for the simple reason - they had NO information to work with.

We are only now slowly coming out of this, and the education process should include this subject beginning at least in Jr High. People today still insist on personifying aspects of life (mythopoeic thinking), and seeing things where "things" do not exist (pareidolia). I'll give you an example of the latter that I found regarding the 'head' area of the Orion nebula. I found this picture while cruising pictures of m42-M43 / the Orion Nebula awhile back. If you look at this, there seems to be a "grey" head emerging from a more "human" head. Is this what is really there? Or is this just a coincidence created by expanding gases? Maybe it's - ET art work LOL ... or a created CG picture.

I split both figures away from each other, mirrored each half and folded it over to create a complete "face" for both halves. Is this real? Is the nebula sending us a message? Or is it just a created picture based on what we think we see?

By the way what did you mean about people disappearing, when the Masons came into existence? (ordinary people/ prominent members of society/ others?).

The premise is based on logic and human nature. 5000+ years ago fear created a scenario that changed thinking in one area of the globe, Egypt and Sumer. Since human nature doesn't change, I would say there had to be people who disagreed with any changes to doctrine, and they packed their bags and left the area. Over time they would have been living in plain sight with the rest of the population, and no one would have known they were there.

Glimpses of the idea would pop up here and there in religious texts, but the first major move to activate the main belief itself became the religion we know as Christianity. All the component parts are there, it's just a different cast of characters. Biblical scholars have shown that "Paul" expected the "end" in his lifetime - but it never happened. The texts were altered by unknown writers in specific places to cover the error and make it look like it would come - later. We have been waiting 2000 years, a ton of guesstimates over that time have surfaced, and all have been wrong.

Earlier in the game I thought "the people who knew" just disbanded after that, but things popped up that said no, they were still there. The last person who seemed to have run into them was Nostradamus, seemingly after he dropped out of the picture for 6 years. There are a very small handful of quatrains that show he knew about our fallen history, as well as when it happened - and THAT is impossible.

If these people had been living their lives in secret, when the Masonic movement began to expand it would almost seem like they belonged together - so ... they joined up?

I say this because of at least two works that popped up: one was 'Fulcanelli's' addition to 'his' 1926 book in 1957. The main idea expressed is fear - 'something bad is coming' and it is going to be catastrophic. The second was published ten years later, called the Red Serpent document. This document is an esoteric quest in the context of destruction, to find the key - the feminine character involved in this - and he found it. From here we can add the Georgia Guidestones, as well as all of the crap that has gone on at least since 911. They know. They also know that we are supposed to know - and we don't - and in true sociopathic form ... they don't care.

Seeing as I can trace a small picture that seems to end in 1885, and pops up today in a quest for an answer to the same base question, what else can I think? "The people who knew" should have surfaced by now, and haven't. What we DO have are the WRONG people waving the material in front of our faces - and not telling us anything.

In Fortean Times there is a section dedicated to this phenomena. It's photos readers send in of things that resemble other things, from trees and rocks that look like faces, to the name of Allah written in a vegetable or Jesus's face in toast.

Everything comes to an end. All civilizations are born, grow old and die, just like individuals. The only question is what will kill them and when (accident, disease (plague), war (violent death)). As for those claiming to know when - what is their motive? The French say look for the female in a crime. I say look for someone's motive in any statement they make. Are they trying to scare you or make you react in any particular way (herd you/ draw you in a particular direction) or is that they just want to inform you of a dispassionate fact?

paigetheoracle wrote:: The French say look for the female in a crime. I say look for someone's motive in any statement they make. Are they trying to scare you or make you react in any particular way (herd you/ draw you in a particular direction) or is that they just want to inform you of a dispassionate fact?

Everything is the brain ... everything. If you can get to a point where you understand the basic components and how they work, tie into problems like sociopathy for example, people and their motives (if they have one) become - apparent.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: The French say look for the female in a crime. I say look for someone's motive in any statement they make. Are they trying to scare you or make you react in any particular way (herd you/ draw you in a particular direction) or is that they just want to inform you of a dispassionate fact?

Everything is the brain ... everything. If you can get to a point where you understand the basic components and how they work, tie into problems like sociopathy for example, people and their motives (if they have one) become - apparent.

Nothing is without purpose - even a simple reaction to relieve yourself of stress, has meaning (stimulus-response). When people think of motive, they usually believe in convoluted thinking but it can be as simple as a chain reaction, the way I define it. Understanding is the key, you're right on that. Why we do what we do, whether it is just a simple reaction or a well thought out idea. Simple reactions are clean but crude - complex ones are sophisticated and emotionally twisting. When you remove the past, the latter disappears because it requires time to develop. This is why Eastern religion goes on about the need to dump preconceptions and return to simplicity, so we don't get tricked by our own minds.

By the way, with regards to the disappearing groups from the past. This is because such people exist around the world and are never popular for the very quotes you use in your signature, whereas those that jump at the chance for publicity, are. Shy, retiring, humble, honest people don't want to stand out and be seen. They are the background boys, like the backstage people in a theatre make a production possible but it is the actors everybody sees and remembers.

Simulcra Corner is the name of the readers photos section of Fortean Times, I've just remembered.

paigetheoracle wrote:: Nothing is without purpose - even a simple reaction to relieve yourself of stress, has meaning (stimulus-response). When people think of motive, they usually believe in convoluted thinking but it can be as simple as a chain reaction, the way I define it. Understanding is the key, you're right on that. Why we do what we do, whether it is just a simple reaction or a well thought out idea. Simple reactions are clean but crude - complex ones are sophisticated and emotionally twisting. When you remove the past, the latter disappears because it requires time to develop. This is why Eastern religion goes on about the need to dump preconceptions and return to simplicity, so we don't get tricked by our own minds.

When I explain this concept to my grandchildren (because it isn't the 1950s anymore - unfortunately) I keep it simple. The brain is everything, the body is the means by which the brain gets from place to place and the vehicle that gets it what it wants.

My granddaughter is pre-diabetic; she is a carbohydrate junkie. She doesn't want to deal with the problem and the idea is, I explain which parts of the brain in total this approach is coming from, and these ideas prohibit the neocortex from doing its job. In essence, her 'thinking' is being 'hijacked.' The r-complex and mid-brain don't care about rational thought (neocortex), and just want what they want regardless of the consequences.

The idea is, people 'dumping preconceptions and returning to simplicity' is not the answer they need. They need to look at those preconceptions and understand why they are not valid.

Every time I see a picture of a Muslim woman, she is completely covered. Why is that? Because men know they will be aroused (r-complex and mid-brain) and this will put them in a state their 'god' will not approve of. Why can't we just tell it like it is? Arousal is part of the normal processing picture created by the input of the r-complex and mid-brain, and the 'god' involved is left over mythopoeic thinking. Well, you can't tell them because their thinking has been hijacked. Rational thought does not exist in a hijack situation. Fear (r-complex) has completely dominated the processing picture, and unless you can bypass that fear with logic it will never change. I find it fascinating that if you die for god, you wind up with 72 virgins - gee, what part of the brain do you think THAT comes from LOL?

By the way, with regards to the disappearing groups from the past. This is because such people exist around the world and are never popular for the very quotes you use in your signature, whereas those that jump at the chance for publicity, are. Shy, retiring, humble, honest people don't want to stand out and be seen. They are the background boys, like the backstage people in a theatre make a production possible but it is the actors everybody sees and remembers.

The only 'disappearing group' I'm concerned with is the Clovis culture. Outside of the fact that the feminine symbol was NOT part of their culture, there isn't much else to go on. The comet was not diverted - which is odd in itself. I keep going back to an old picture where ET found a dead, or almost dead, planet. Everyone died, and they went back in time to save the ones smart enough to live through it. This would explain why they let people die in a calamity they weren't smart enough to avoid in the first place - they died anyway originally. This is just a picture in my head, and if you take the Fukushima disaster and multiply it something like 436 times, any disaster that cuts power and cripples those reactors will flood the planet with radiation and kill everyone. Like I said, it's just an unverifiable picture ... would make a good movie though LOL.

Simulcra Corner is the name of the readers photos section of Fortean Times, I've just remembered.

Gotta love the brain.

Thanks to David Williams, who sent us this great photo of some faces in the bushes. He writes: "A photo I shot in the garden of th old monastery at Bury St Edmunds. I don't know if the bushes are meant to look like faces but I don't think so! But I love the way they are eying up that little squirrel."
http://www.forteantimes.com/community/photos/5893/simulacra_faces_in_the_bushes.html

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: Nothing is without purpose - even a simple reaction to relieve yourself of stress, has meaning (stimulus-response). When people think of motive, they usually believe in convoluted thinking but it can be as simple as a chain reaction, the way I define it. Understanding is the key, you're right on that. Why we do what we do, whether it is just a simple reaction or a well thought out idea. Simple reactions are clean but crude - complex ones are sophisticated and emotionally twisting. When you remove the past, the latter disappears because it requires time to develop. This is why Eastern religion goes on about the need to dump preconceptions and return to simplicity, so we don't get tricked by our own minds.

When I explain this concept to my grandchildren (because it isn't the 1950s anymore - unfortunately) I keep it simple. The brain is everything, the body is the means by which the brain gets from place to place and the vehicle that gets it what it wants.

My granddaughter is pre-diabetic; she is a carbohydrate junkie. She doesn't want to deal with the problem and the idea is, I explain which parts of the brain in total this approach is coming from, and these ideas prohibit the neocortex from doing its job. In essence, her 'thinking' is being 'hijacked.' The r-complex and mid-brain don't care about rational thought (neocortex), and just want what they want regardless of the consequences.

The idea is, people 'dumping preconceptions and returning to simplicity' is not the answer they need. They need to look at those preconceptions and understand why they are not valid.

Every time I see a picture of a Muslim woman, she is completely covered. Why is that? Because men know they will be aroused (r-complex and mid-brain) and this will put them in a state their 'god' will not approve of. Why can't we just tell it like it is? Arousal is part of the normal processing picture created by the input of the r-complex and mid-brain, and the 'god' involved is left over mythopoeic thinking. Well, you can't tell them because their thinking has been hijacked. Rational thought does not exist in a hijack situation. Fear (r-complex) has completely dominated the processing picture, and unless you can bypass that fear with logic it will never change. I find it fascinating that if you die for god, you wind up with 72 virgins - gee, what part of the brain do you think THAT comes from LOL?

By the way, with regards to the disappearing groups from the past. This is because such people exist around the world and are never popular for the very quotes you use in your signature, whereas those that jump at the chance for publicity, are. Shy, retiring, humble, honest people don't want to stand out and be seen. They are the background boys, like the backstage people in a theatre make a production possible but it is the actors everybody sees and remembers.

The only 'disappearing group' I'm concerned with is the Clovis culture. Outside of the fact that the feminine symbol was NOT part of their culture, there isn't much else to go on. The comet was not diverted - which is odd in itself. I keep going back to an old picture where ET found a dead, or almost dead, planet. Everyone died, and they went back in time to save the ones smart enough to live through it. This would explain why they let people die in a calamity they weren't smart enough to avoid in the first place - they died anyway originally. This is just a picture in my head, and if you take the Fukushima disaster and multiply it something like 436 times, any disaster that cuts power and cripples those reactors will flood the planet with radiation and kill everyone. Like I said, it's just an unverifiable picture ... would make a good movie though LOL.

Simulcra Corner is the name of the readers photos section of Fortean Times, I've just remembered.

Gotta love the brain.

Thanks to David Williams, who sent us this great photo of some faces in the bushes. He writes: "A photo I shot in the garden of th old monastery at Bury St Edmunds. I don't know if the bushes are meant to look like faces but I don't think so! But I love the way they are eying up that little squirrel."
http://www.forteantimes.com/community/photos/5893/simulacra_faces_in_the_bushes.html

Talking of the faces in the bushes reminds of other reports in Fortean Times that are more than simulcra. This is where the environment itself is manipulated by a elemental being or force. This has come from various sources over a wide time period, so is not a hoax or misinformation. One was a story of somebody hillwalking, who saw the top of a mountain with a living red face on it. Another more recent one was of a guy waiting for a train, who thought he saw a simulcra of a face in the vegetation, then it moved and withdrew as a force, reverting back to just bushes and trees (a veritable green man). A third was just a curtain but it had been turned into a giant face by something - again not static but a force at work.

I'd heard of the Clovis people but knew nothing of them until now.

The scenario sounds totally reasonable. Think of Lot and his wife. 'The Lord' rescued those who would listen and left the rest to their own devices i.e.to die through their own negligence of common facts that would have saved them. People do need to examine their own preconceptions but will they, even if it kills them to give up their addictive lifeastyle? History says otherwise, sadly.

What you say about Muslim women and male hypocrisy is really amazing and amusing! The way you can lead people into the valley of stupidity, just by getting them to believe contradictory thoughts about reality (screw them up then screw them - division and conquest or keeping their bodies and heads separate).

paigetheoracle wrote:: What you say about Muslim women and male hypocrisy is really amazing and amusing! The way you can lead people into the valley of stupidity, just by getting them to believe contradictory thoughts about reality (screw them up then screw them - division and conquest or keeping their bodies and heads separate).

I just watched a new show on H2 (History channel 2) about the Pharaohs and the gods and how the priests used the idea of gods to make "their" lives complete, and the people STILL lived a common life. I can excuse this because the people had no clue and couldn't put 2 and 2 together because there was no hard data. Today we have the hard data and people still are focused on this mythopoeic idea of gods. It was an open door for the manipulating sociopath back then, and they are STILL using it today.

Seeker Number of posts : 32 Registration date : 2011-10-10

onlychild wrote:

paigetheoracle wrote:: What you say about Muslim women and male hypocrisy is really amazing and amusing! The way you can lead people into the valley of stupidity, just by getting them to believe contradictory thoughts about reality (screw them up then screw them - division and conquest or keeping their bodies and heads separate).

I just watched a new show on H2 (History channel 2) about the Pharaohs and the gods and how the priests used the idea of gods to make "their" lives complete, and the people STILL lived a common life. I can excuse this because the people had no clue and couldn't put 2 and 2 together because there was no hard data. Today we have the hard data and people still are focused on this mythopoeic idea of gods. It was an open door for the manipulating sociopath back then, and they are STILL using it today.

I have a lot to say so pin back your lugholes as they used to say in the UK. Why religion and why alien manipulation of this phenomena? (Lourdes, Fatima, Medjugore etc). Simple - this is the way to get a society moving forward into the future. Negative people focus on the past and defend it against all progress. Gods (the advanced) are the target direction for the general populace (The father reaches of space). Look at current life and celebrity culture (carrot and stick). Materialism is the child's way of looking at the world but not the nappy changing/ hunting adult, who are stuck with the practicalities of life (dressing up as Father Christmas, pretending to be the Tooth Fairy, so the grim reality of life doesn't put kids off staying in this world).

Douglas Adams in one of his Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy books, talks about The Golgafinchan 'B' Ark. This is where all the pointless, meaningless, shallow people on a planet, were persuaded to evacuate it and that is what we face now (Big Egos but small brains, wallowing in materialism). This has shown up in the drift of students away from science subjects to artistic ones, in the UK at least. It also shows up science programs, which state what Metro's (free giveaway paper) science column calls 'the bleeding obvious.' A good example was a recent edition of 'Horizon' on BBC2, that tried to explain the Big Bang as followed by a sudden (unexplained) expansion, to fit in with the facts and figures. This reminded me of an Orrery, a complex working model that tried to explain the seemingly strange movement of the planets as circles, rather than accept a simpler model of elliptical orbits for them. Again this defense of old outdated ideas (dark matter, energy, flow) rather than accept they don't know and won't entertain other ideas, possibly like The Electric Universe theory.

We have to accept that new arrivals to this planet will be materially orientated - mistaking the toys, position and power as important, rather than just seeing them as here to test your mind and abilities (Roman Triumphs and the laurel holder whispering in the conquering general's ear 'Remember thou art mortal'). Consciousness is concentration upon the here and now as mental dispersal is lost in dreams and symbolism (The UK charity 'Sense About Science' is currently running a campaign aimed at unsubstantiated claims in advertising, telling the public to ask for evidence, rather than accept what they are told by these and Government, news and other sources: In other words grow up and think for your self. Don't be led by lies).

Getting back to alien intervention. Could it be that we are acting as monitors for them on the mental level as animal mutilation is checking out physical changes? Looking at the past, could it be that we are the garden and they are the gardeners? (Every time there is a disaster, they pluck out the best of the crop and then replant them, after the problem passes).