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 Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?

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glider
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 3:33 pm

Hello Only Child,

Innovative idea. Take it from me, even on a small scale (like an UfO Forum perhaps), getting humans to do things as a group is like herding cats! No offense to the race- merely an observation. Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:39 pm

glider wrote:
Hello Only Child,

Innovative idea. Take it from me, even on a small scale (like an UfO Forum perhaps), getting humans to do things as a group is like herding cats! No offense to the race- merely an observation. Laughing
Yeah, but hard is not impossible - that's why there are two different words. Very Happy

Look, this is "OUR" planet - not TPTB. ET has come to OUR planet for US - not THEM. People say "I want to know!" Then dammit let's do it. Who the hell are these secret people to stand in our way? We are 6+ billion strong - and they are but a handful. All we want is a greeting and we can do that very peacefully. We need someone to orchestrate this over the net - it isn't impossible it just takes an effort. Frankly I don't care what the naysayers have to say, they can sit in their chairs and watch tv ... I say the majority will try this. Everyone stand up at the agreed on time, look up to the sky and say hi. It's never been tried - let's do it.

Where's Bill?
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:46 pm

Hello Only Child,

My Goodness, what's come over you? Have you hit the wall? I don't think you are alone. My name and address is on one of my posts- hang it out there and let's see who chops it off, hmmm? You are right of course in assuming that a guy like Bill could indeed generate a movement.

I almost regret saying how strongly I felt about the same initiative but on a much smaller scale as you know. There were those that hinted at the futility of such a pursuit WRT the opposition one could face and I did indeed get a taste of that sort of thing with my attempts at contact with several "official" UFO reporting agencies.

Conclusion? Groups do BETTER. Everyone knows it. If you want we could at least get the ball rolling with a blurb in all the UFO mags announcing a date, say, Columbus Day weekend in Oct.. Or go really for Independence Day, you know-Go Big Or Go Home!

Anyway after some info for people to PEN into their calenders we could put a bug into the ears of the local media. Who cares if they joke and rank on it on the air the result will be the same. Publicity for an agenda that has a DATE, could be amazing! Washington will hear it, the world will hear it. And I for one think the world is ready. I know I am. And you, and Leslie, the Birneses and Dave Fair, and Gort, and Gigas, and Free Wheel. Not to mention Vortexasylum, Lakehurst, and yes Philip too! As well as the other over 400 members, other Forums and their members and who knows, maybe eventually the "official" UFO orgs. as well.

Let me put it this way, gotta start SOMETIME, right? Pick a date Only Child. I feel it's only fair after all your research and efforts both personally and the generous time and patience you've showed this Forum. Pick a date and take a deep breath! It is the BEGINNING and I already feel the effort I attempted at my outset to instill some drive in the Forum was not in vain. We are intelligent, we do ask great questions but we always end up asking each other over and over.

Let's get some answers and let's give ourselves a year to accompish it. I want to know what the Black Triangles are and if we find ET is real then the BT's will, by default, spill out. If it's okay with you, when we have our date I would be more than happy to inform those Forums and the necessary websites WRT to BT's. It would be my pleasure.

Make it so Number One!
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:45 pm

Hello All,

As postscript to the last post the world can all start at the same instant but it won't be at the same time of day for everyone of course. So I propose a 24 hr. time frame so that, across the Globe, everybody will get a shot at daytime as well as nightime sightings and provide the maximum advantage not to the viewer but perhaps to the watchers as well.

Who knows, maybe some companies have a believer for a boss and will have everyone paid for UFO Day. Afterall it would be a truly momentus and an historical event should something occur, no? It could turn out to be the most important day for several thousands of years.

It would be great if the World actually got involved and could possibly solve the entire thing a year from now would it not? I don't think this is anything like a new idea or anything like that BUT with todays technology and communications wizardry along with the w.w.w. it's a pretty good thing timing wise..............DUH, YA THINK?

Hey, OC. Speaking of dates, when's your birthday? You cam PM me if you want. Hpoefully it isn't an early-in-the-year one. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:53 pm

I'm all about this idea. How about a hello at night and a candle or flash light?
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:26 pm

Solving it? Precludes the possibility that "it" has already been solved or in part worked out by governments pouring money into research. As far as the human mind goes and what it is capable of, I'm not sure I'd be game to make any personal submissions on the topic after having read "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins.

With regard to ancient civilizations and aliens/ufos, I think more than mere opinion is involved. The complex social issues of masks, crowns, badges of office etc., infer that no one answer will suit all. Perhaps it's a case of "no wrong answer".

This is a very interesting topic.

Cheers

Rob
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glider
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:52 pm

Hello Vortexasylum,

I was thinking more along the lines of a 3+ million candlepower spot myself but one can't go overboard I guess. you know, Sky watching is truly a lost art. We aren't Mayan, nor are we Druid, nor are we Phaeronic, or shamans or Oracles in Delphi. Watching the skies is even nearly a lost art to meteorologists! The path ahead could have far reaching effects by helping people get back in touch with the fragility of our fair Home and take a more active interest in sussing out lies in the power structure as a whole. Not wreck it, not destroy it, just keep a better eye on it and the new industries (and scams) that always result as new discoveries, materials, and frontiers open up.

Hopefully, a better world brotherhood in which we actuall do leave no one behind or in need. Psychically the Planet needs it. People need to feel good about themselves and have worth. The more I think about it the more I realize that, UFO or not, we could use the excercise to grow up. AND it becomes more apparent why we have been lulled into the human condition that we are in. I always feel the World is on the brink in every manner one can think of and that the interrelationship of the elements (societal, environmental etc.) are such that one imbalance will upset the entire apple cart.

I know it's a lot of weight for an idea but, like I said, one has to start sometime if the big WHY is out there for us as a planetary civilization. We should start treating ourselves as if we were the ones on another planet. It just may well be so. How would we want another planet to treat their citizens?
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:13 pm

Hello Roberto

Roberto wrote:
Solving it? Precludes the possibility that "it" has already been solved or in part worked out by governments pouring money into research. As far as the human mind goes and what it is capable of, I'm not sure I'd be game to make any personal submissions on the topic after having read "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins.

With regard to ancient civilizations and aliens/ufos, I think more than mere opinion is involved. The complex social issues of masks, crowns, badges of office etc., infer that no one answer will suit all. Perhaps it's a case of "no wrong answer".

This is a very interesting topic.

Cheers

Rob

Yes, solving it. Because it is NOT a resolved issue that I know of. Only Child said something to the effect that, when successful, TPTB will have to either be in admission or denial on the subject. In either outcome few will look good (if ET is real). As you can see I am objective. It's because I've never seen anything myself that I would call an UFO. But for some reason the stories, the constant sightings others have had (and still do) and, for me at least, the Black Triangles, have just been begging for a solution.

Good enough for me. Either way, whether they exist or not, or whether they've been known about or not, something definitely WILL be found out. There,s a lot of money floating around WRT UFO literature, and a lot of money spent in investigations both Federal and otherwise to have everything just go away in a year or so. Lots and lots of money spent and generated for 60+ yrs. So this is anything BUT a frivolous gesture.

And, of course, you are correct in saying that the subject is quite interesting. With hope and perserverance it will turn out to be more than mere entertainment by magnitudes.

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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:23 pm

I agree, as our knowledge amasses, breakthroughs will occur if they haven't already. I'm sure that private industry will be right behind some of the discoveries. As you said, some people aren't going to look to good when the news breaks. Perhaps that's part of the problem. Image could drag down a government very quickly and as surely as economic mismanagement.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:34 pm

glider wrote:
Hello Vortexasylum,

I was thinking more along the lines of a 3+ million candlepower spot myself but one can't go overboard I guess. you know, Sky watching is truly a lost art. We aren't Mayan, nor are we Druid, nor are we Phaeronic, or shamans or Oracles in Delphi. Watching the skies is even nearly a lost art to meteorologists! The path ahead could have far reaching effects by helping people get back in touch with the fragility of our fair Home and take a more active interest in sussing out lies in the power structure as a whole. Not wreck it, not destroy it, just keep a better eye on it and the new industries (and scams) that always result as new discoveries, materials, and frontiers open up.

Hopefully, a better world brotherhood in which we actuall do leave no one behind or in need. Psychically the Planet needs it. People need to feel good about themselves and have worth. The more I think about it the more I realize that, UFO or not, we could use the excercise to grow up. AND it becomes more apparent why we have been lulled into the human condition that we are in. I always feel the World is on the brink in every manner one can think of and that the interrelationship of the elements (societal, environmental etc.) are such that one imbalance will upset the entire apple cart.

I know it's a lot of weight for an idea but, like I said, one has to start sometime if the big WHY is out there for us as a planetary civilization. We should start treating ourselves as if we were the ones on another planet. It just may well be so. How would we want another planet to treat their citizens?

Hey glider, I think that if everyone had 3 mil cp spot we be in business for sure. We'll have to deal with limitations and some consistent themes I would assume, so candles would be out of the ordinary and more accessible. Just a thought. Also; your'e eloquent in speech and thought not to mention an overt piece maker and I think someone like you would be a great ambassador for humans. You have my vote. I say we set the wheel in motion. Simple is good.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:40 pm

Hello All,

Sorry for the wordy postings. I think I've said all I can say on the matter. And you know how it's stated:

Those who can, do. And those can't, talk about it.

I need one (and only one) thing now- a Calender Date.

P.S. I said "calender" 'cause I know you folks now. One can't leave one's self too open here. If I'da just said "date" why you'da been all over it like a summer suit! Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:52 pm

Hello Vortexasylum,

Yep you are absolutely correct. Candles say more and say it better. No light will be extinguished then. Edison, Watt, Volt and all those guys would be astounded at the possible outcome of that little invention of theirs! It could be the only reason it came into being as far as I know.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 10:09 pm

Hello Roberto,

Roberto wrote:
I agree, as our knowledge amasses, breakthroughs will occur if they haven't already. I'm sure that private industry will be right behind some of the discoveries. As you said, some people aren't going to look to good when the news breaks. Perhaps that's part of the problem. Image could drag down a government very quickly and as surely as economic mismanagement.

Yes, indeed it is! Thank you for seeing it as it is a major factor. A litte revolution would be OK. A lot? Not so good. The alternative? Playing out one's suspicions on Forums. Forever. Now as bad as that sounds it certainly is not as bad as anarchy.

I KNOW! We could do what others who found out the Truth may have done. Strike a deal for our silence. Yeah, thats it. That's the ticket. Then use the money to start UFO orgs. and Forums to generate more money. We would be filthy rich, have our parking tickets torn up, go on nationwide TV- mainstream- as debunkers- and tell...................NAAAAAAAHHH.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 10:45 pm

OC is the calender expert and I believe this is his idea. I think this might work well with the lights out project. Just a thought.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:18 pm

OK ... what we need to do is first realize that this is an attempt to do something and we have no idea what the outcome will be. I want to say that "they" will go along with it, but there may be things we don't know.

The remark about synchronization of times globally was a good thought, and we need to fix our thinking on a picture so that it can be delivered intelligently - not like some wack-a-doodle idea people can laugh about. The only reason this is even crossing my mind is because quite frankly I have had it with dismissal rhetoric every time someone comes up with something or sees something or has a positive analysis done on something. ET isn't doing much, and when they do something - more dismissals or just more "it isn't good enough". So - we need to try something else and this is something I think can work. "We the people" want to meet you. Come on down Very Happy

As far as Bill - we need someone with connections and unless someone has something against Bill being out there (if he wants to be) speak up. People know him and they trust him.

Lets just take some time and talk about this. No rush.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:29 pm

I think Bill would be fine. We also need to think about maybe using all the social networks available.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 12:33 am

Hello Only Child,

Yes, proceed with some sensibility. Time as you say is basically on our side for now. Bill is fine with me too. You know I don't want to screw this up in any fashion and I think checking in with ideas for a plan is crucial. I'm for caution and precision. We can be kind to reputations which will make the going a litte easier. If it snowballs 4 mos. from now it could get dicey.

Presentation to the public through whatever avenues is something to be honed. I couldn't agree more. Hey, OC, maybe the IT that is coming is US! Too arrogant? Yeah, nevermind. I think the public will respond positively but they need to realize that this is NOT a doomsday or 2012 or California going into the ocean kind of thing. It's a watch, it's a "show of hands" so to speak. It's also circumventing the usual channels one follow for lack of support or risking a public stigma.

There is also that school of thought that advises a low profile lest we attract a bad element (ETwise). Personally I think it's a little late for that. At least locally. SETI broadcasts may in fact not be a good idea right now. Too far reaching for my taste. Insofar as the local events have been around for so long with no apparent agressiveness, I'm more inclined to think any contact will be fairly benign and surprise may be an experience both elements will share.

Okay. Enough. Plenty to discuss down the road. We need to act fairly quickly though so we don't get scooped by a group with ill intentions, and not as altruistic as we!. Let's get a plan and get going. I won't pressure you for a date but if you run into difficulty for whatever reason let us know. Right now it looks like you, Vortexasylum, and me. That's good enough to start the ball rolling. It's probably been rolling for some time now, we, or at least I, just didn't know about it. Well......... I do now.


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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 10:16 am

Ok, let's start playing with this. (If the pics are taking up too much of the screen, hit and hold "CONTROL" and then hit " - " once or twice to shrink the screen.)

A name:
The asking: Operation Hi in the sky? (All we are looking for / asking for is a global sky arrival, not a landing that would probably scare the hell out of most people.)

A date:
Stonehenge has a bunch of astronomical alignments attached to it. One day I looked at the sky at 3000 BC from those coordinates, and noticed something odd ... on both the summer solstice sunrise and the winter solstice sunset - the eastern sky was the same. Orion was rising, and in the sunrise picture of the summer solstice, Leo was in the same position we would see in a side view of the Sphinx looking at the risen sun in the east.

Now, we can't duplicate the sky at sunrise on those dates, but we can celebrate the Orion nebula rising at sunrise, making it our own picture. On July 20, at sunrise, from the coordinates of Stonehenge, the nebula and the sun are right on the horizon at 5:20 AM - whatever the Henge time zone is.

These are desktop pics of the summer solstice sunrise 3000 BC, the winter solstice sunset 3000 BC, and the July 20th 2011 sunrise date as viewed from the Stonehenge coordinates.

Just a run up the flag pole and mistakes need to be looked for on better astronomical programs.





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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 11:18 am

Hello Only Child,

So is that the call? Summer Solstice is fine by me. Gives us about 4.5 Months, should be enough time. Anyone else?

P.S. Good work OC.


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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 11:45 am

I would say we now need to get our front man on board. His reputation is on the line and his input will be necessary for a cogent plan.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 12:08 pm

glider wrote:
Hello Only Child,

So is that the call? Summer Solstice is fine by me. Anyone Gives us about 4.5 Months, should be enough time. Anyone else?

July 20 is not connected to anything ancient - it's just a date that incorporates the symbol archetype (Orion Nebula) rising with the sun at an ancient site coordinates. We can kick it around.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 12:14 pm

Hello Vortexasylum,

That would be Bill? I have to say I know nothing of him. I am however trusting your and OC's recommendations.

And I will say this for the record, I am 110% on board here!
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:32 pm

Hello OC & V,

I just went on line for Ufo Conferences, 2011. There's a lot. For instance, the Ozark UFO Conference is in it's 23rd year! It could be a great way to get the word out because those attendees might just take the news back to wherever they came from and spread it onto the'r respective Forums and other groups as well. Some of these, if not all, are international conferences.
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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:55 pm

There are 15 or so ufo sites on facebook. I will search myspace and youtube. (youtube could take forever) If we make connections to a fraction of these the word should spread quickly. Our mantra if you will, needs to be short and to the point for retention purposes alone. I'm sure the word is already working it's way out. We should not be angry or upset if this takes off on someone else's charge as long as the objective is achieved. My view. We should keep repeating the date of July 20, 2011 though to get it locked in.


June 21, 2011


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PostSubject: Re: Ancient Astronauts or Undiscovered Ancient Civilization?   Sun Feb 06, 2011 2:05 pm

Vortexasylum wrote:
We should not be angry or upset if this takes off on someone else's charge as long as the objective is achieved.

Yeah, because that's all that matters. How do we get hold of Bill?
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