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 Morristown Hoax Aftermath

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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 12, 2009 11:53 am

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LakehurstNJwitness
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 12, 2009 3:11 pm

Alfred Lehmberg wrote:
You, Sir, are a sneering popinjay who lied on camera to law enforcement in the commission of an irresponsible ruse of the most egregious malfeasance, and then try to pass it off as public service!

You got off light. If it were up to me our parks and highways would be a lot cleaner for a much longer period of time. See, you're the reason people are so easy to keep scared and then unaware of what's really happening around them if a threat is present. You lie. You were convicted for it. What fruit is that tree supposed to bear?

No. Do not pretend to tell me what your "intentions" were; the expressions on your faces and your gleeful reportage are all the illustration required. Step off.


alienview@roadrunner.com
> www.AlienView.net
>> AVG Blog -- http://alienviewgroup.blogspot.com/
>>> U F O M a g a z i n e -- www.ufomag.com


There you go again ... angry responses towards someone who is trying to explain himself.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 12, 2009 3:36 pm

Bill is correct when he says the hoax didn't prove to "hoax" the ufo field because the jury was still out on what it represented. UFO Magazine never announced that a flying saucer was seen over New Jersey.

The only "hoax" part of the event was how the media fed into the event without fully knowing what it really was... but I don't even look at that as being such a huge "no-no" , I'm glad the media spent time airing something about strange unknown lights in the sky, I look at that as a good thing , we need all the media coverage we can get.

As far as the 2 men who created the prank, we shouldn't attack them for trying to create a ufo in the sky ... let everybody try and create their best "fake ufo" and we can use them as comparison models against the real authentic video clips and sightings.

There are a whole lot of people out there who don't believe ufo sightings are real , so by us running away from the fakes or trying to prevent or ridicule the pranksters, we don't gain anything. We need to meet the reality of pranks head-on and eventually show the difference at the end of the day.

This goes in line with our other discussion of how the ufo field could help clean itself up by categorizing and organizing itself better. i say list the fakes and video's in their own section like at the publkic library fiction shelves, put the other ones in their own categories, etc ...

I like Bills method of facing each event in a similar and fair way ... get all of the evidence, all of the eyewitness accounts, keep an open mind towards all possibilities ...and throw ideas and possibilities around during conversation and discussion , none of which means he is buying into one idea ore another until a final decision is made on the event.

Let the kids be kids , and let anyone try who thinks they can fool the people ... let the best and brightest create ufo's if they can , and let us be the judge of what appears real and what appears as a fake. It could help us define certain strategies in evaluating such events.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:57 pm

chrisjoerusso, the major problem with your "test" or "experiment" was that you both portrayed witnesses to the event. That does stack the deck in your favor as both of you make claims on the object.

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2009/04/morristown-ufo-hoax.html

You both are not going to get any medals for practicing your deceptions.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:15 pm

Mr. Randle makes some excellent points. I'd not heard about the "recording" of the NJ auto dealership "witness/victims".

Quote :
Now were treated to Russo and Rudy, finding an ad in the local newspaper in which a Ford dealer is exploiting the UFOs for some kind of sale. These two head to the dealership and apparently are unable to convince any of the people there to go on camera, but they leave it running, pointing at the ground (or floor) and record the thoughts of the sales force. BTW, is this sort of recording legal in New Jersey? Remember, they just left the camera running, recording the "witnesses" after they were not allowed to film.


Thanx kidflash2008 Very Happy,

Fix'
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:26 pm

I am only trying to show the hoaxers that what they have done is not any type of experiment when they are involved playing witnesses to the event.

They are young and will learn about life through many experiences themselves. I hope they learn from this and go on to a more fruitful life.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Mon Jul 13, 2009 9:34 am

kidflash2008 wrote:
I am only trying to show the hoaxers that what they have done is not any type of experiment when they are involved playing witnesses to the event.

They are young and will learn about life through many experiences themselves. I hope they learn from this and go on to a more fruitful life.

It could be argued that "power of suggestion" does lend itself to the experiment of "analyzing and evaluating how ufo sightings are handled"

Their experiment shows how one witness embellishing or creaating their account effects how the media and investiagtors handle it. The more embellishment and hype , the more attention it receives.

I understand their experiment, it may rub you the wrong way, but its a reality of eyewitness acounts , you never know what the truth is from any one individual eyewitness .. it does teach us something in my opinion. It can make us better as investigators.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:20 pm

The problem LakehurstNJwitness, is that the hoaxers became witnesses in and embellished their OWN story. That is a major problem, as they are the ones who started the big rumors and then spread the stories that the objects acted in a way they did not. That in itself is why the experiment failed big time.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:24 pm

In a nutshell this is what the two men did:

They created a UFO using flares and then pretended to be witnesses of the object themselves. They embellished their hoax and added information such as strange maneuverings of their own object (that did not happen). Their manipulated story gets reported by THEM, taking the hoax into criminal fraud areas.

How can this be a study of witnesses when the main witnesses are the hoaxers themselves?
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Fri Jul 17, 2009 9:54 pm

July 18 - The Manhattan Project.



Fix'
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sat Jul 18, 2009 10:14 am

There is nothing-new under the Sun... but there's plenty of BS-recycling in the fraudulent "shade of the bunk". Moo. "Former science teacher" and a "pharmaceutical salesman" - sounds about right. Yawn - the "Randi-Million" redux. LOL.

NJ.com link.

Fix'
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Sun Jul 19, 2009 5:26 pm

kidflash2008 wrote:
The problem LakehurstNJwitness, is that the hoaxers became witnesses in and embellished their OWN story. That is a major problem, as they are the ones who started the big rumors and then spread the stories that the objects acted in a way they did not. That in itself is why the experiment failed big time.



That's how you test things ... if the military wants to test the security of one of its bases, they might try using one of their "OWN" to exploit the base security , there's no rules when you're testing how something works.
The other team can't cry foul ... the purpose of the test is to see how we react to the test , not to analyze the test itself. Firemen are tested by putting out car fires, the fireman doesn't complain that "the chief set the car on fire to test how we responded, its not fair thet the chief started the fire and called it in, he embellished and said the fire was out of control , thats not fair" .... the test is to see how the response takes place , how does the ufo investigation respond? thats all.
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PostSubject: Re: Morristown Hoax Aftermath   Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:29 pm

Testing security and a product is much different than testing how people react. The men stated they wanted to see how people would react to seeing the object in the sky. No problem there as they could have released there flares on a balloon frame and just waited for the descriptions to come in from people. What they did is put themselves into the equation and that is always a no-no when doing research such as this type.
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